Comments on: The Blue Book – Part 2 http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/ my journey of recovery from University Bible Fellowship Tue, 29 Mar 2016 16:34:31 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=4.6.1 By: briank http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/#comment-634 Tue, 28 Feb 2012 21:28:48 +0000 http://www.priestlynation.com/?p=635#comment-634 Hello Tom! I am really glad to connect with you finally. I publicly apologize for any malice I showed toward you on the old Voy forums.

Your words demonstrate to me your faith and good conscience, and love. I was told that you are “dangerous”, “crazy”, “bitter” and “very wounded.” So I was always fearful when your name came up from time to time! But I see that you are none of those… well ok maybe a bit crazy :)

I have found that I am much happier submitting to the Holy Spirit and His rule in my life. Who guides us into all truth? The Spirit, the Third Person of God.

I like your last words above: “to demonstrate Christ’s unrelenting love.” That is our one goal, as in 1 Timothy 1:5 “The goal of this command is love, which comes from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith.”

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By: Tom Fosler http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/#comment-631 Tue, 28 Feb 2012 17:37:03 +0000 http://www.priestlynation.com/?p=635#comment-631 Hey Brian,

Those are some really good thoughts. The other thing I should add is that UBF 1-to-1 Bible Study is inherently unbiblical. For true, Spirit-led Bible Study to occur between two (or more) people, there needs to be two additional factors: 100% Confidentiality and Mutual Accountability. This is in line with Jesus’ command to His disciples that “the first shall be last and the last first” and that “they shall know us by our love for each other”. With the paradigm of UBF Spiritual Authority, there is no work of the Holy Spirit. How can the Spirit do its job when the “Shepherd” is doing all the work? We already have a High Priest interceding for us; we don’t need a “Shepherd”. Friends and brothers to help us in our struggle and knowledge is what we need. Proverbs 27:17 says, “As Iron sharpens Iron, so does one man sharpen another,” NOT “As High-Tensile Tool Steel sharpens Iron, so does one man wear away at the other with self-righteous judgmentalism.” (I made a funny–Ha!) UBF 1-to-1 Bible Study becomes a work of the Shepherd’s spirit and not the Holy Spirit. It is not up to us to judge or lord over others, but to demonstrate Christ’s unrelenting love.

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By: admin http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/#comment-537 Sat, 19 Nov 2011 13:41:46 +0000 http://www.priestlynation.com/?p=635#comment-537 CC,

You asked: “Why did the writers of the blue book become the judge and jury of those who left?”

My thinking is that the “blue book” is the natural progression of a ministry that lacks leadership accountability (and at the same time gives life-long, absolute power to leaders).

It was rather shocking to read the blue book lectures because it codifies some of the things former members have been saying for more than 30 years.

For me, the blue book teachings (along with the 50th anniversary celebrations) solidified my desire to never return to UBF. My conscience as a Christian, as an American and as a human being simply won’t allow it.

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By: admin http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/#comment-536 Sat, 19 Nov 2011 13:36:23 +0000 http://www.priestlynation.com/?p=635#comment-536 CC, thank you for the reminders! All I can say in response is: Amen.

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By: CC http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/#comment-534 Sat, 19 Nov 2011 12:08:44 +0000 http://www.priestlynation.com/?p=635#comment-534 Those who left UBF can say:
We are fools for Christ, but you are so wise in Christ! We are weak, but you are strong! You are honored, we are dishonored!
To this very hour we go hungry and thirsty, we are in rags, we are brutally treated, we are homeless. We work hard with our own hands. When we are cursed, we bless; when we are persecuted, we endure it; when we are slandered, we answer kindly. Up t this moment we have become the scum of the earth, the refuse of the world. (1C0r 4)

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By: CC http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/#comment-533 Sat, 19 Nov 2011 12:03:12 +0000 http://www.priestlynation.com/?p=635#comment-533 Why did the writers of the blue book become the judge and jury of those who left?

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By: CC http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/#comment-532 Sat, 19 Nov 2011 11:45:21 +0000 http://www.priestlynation.com/?p=635#comment-532 Regarding those who left UBF: All these people are living by faith until they die. They did not receive the things promiesd, they only see them and welcome them from a distance. And they admit that they are aliens and strangers on earth. People who say such things show that they are looking for a country of their own. If they had been thinking of the country they had left, they would have had opportunity to return. Instead they are longing for a better country–a heavenly one. Therefore, God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a city for them.

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By: CC http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/#comment-513 Fri, 28 Oct 2011 11:15:17 +0000 http://www.priestlynation.com/?p=635#comment-513 So a Korean culture is now replaced with a “culture of mature” actions…a twist of words to hide their “absolute” practices.

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By: BrianK http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/#comment-498 Fri, 21 Oct 2011 18:11:32 +0000 http://www.priestlynation.com/?p=635#comment-498 No there is not a lot of detail about the specific businesses that UBF people have set up (like the orchestra group, the medical hospital, the Ximeta technology, the tutoring business, etc.).

The section called “Social Responsibility in Action” briefly mentions the medical mission in Africa, as well as suggesting a new “seed bank account” business.

There is a lot of talk about “self-supporting” business, and a lot of talk about Apostle Paul’s tent-making business. There is a comment about utilizing US immigration law to send missionaries. And of course many examples of nurses going to Germany, etc.

Wow, I just can’t believe some of the statements in this book… I really need to put it down for a while!

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By: Chris http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/#comment-497 Fri, 21 Oct 2011 16:59:55 +0000 http://www.priestlynation.com/?p=635#comment-497 “Nobody can deny” … any longer that UBF shows many traits of a cult, right?

Btw, does the “Blue Book” also talk about “business mission”, something Peter Chang from Bonn pursues and propagates since several years?

How pretty audacious of these chief ideologists to proclaim “self-supporting spirit”, while most top-ranking people in UBF get salaries or pensions. I know this from my chapter leader, we paid him a salary and he also got “extra vacation payment”.

You raise some very good points. Thanks a lot for publishing this.

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By: BrianK http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/#comment-496 Fri, 21 Oct 2011 16:03:09 +0000 http://www.priestlynation.com/?p=635#comment-496 Is doctrine valued more highly than people?

“If one questions the beliefs of the group or the leaders of the group, one is made to feel that there is something inherently wrong with them to even question — it is always “turned around” on them and the questioner/criticizer is questioned rather than the questions answered directly. The underlying assumption is that doctrine/ideology is ultimately more valid, true and real than any aspect of actual human character or human experience and one must subject one’s experience to that “truth”. The experience of contradiction can be immediately associated with the guilt one is made to feel and that doubts are reflections of one’s own evil. When doubt arises, conflicts become intense.”

How are those who left the group viewed?

“Since the group has an absolute or totalist vision of truth, those who are not in the group are bound up in evil, are not enlightened, are not saved, and do not have the right to exist; impediments to legitimate being must be pushed away or destroyed. One outside the group may always receive their right of existence by joining the group; fear manipulation — if one leaves this group, one leaves God or loses their salvation/transformation, or something bad will happen to them; the group is the “elite”, outsiders are “of the world”, “evil”, “unenlightened”, etc.”

(source)

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By: BrianK http://www.priestlynation.com/the-blue-book-part-2/#comment-495 Fri, 21 Oct 2011 15:56:39 +0000 http://www.priestlynation.com/?p=635#comment-495 The problem: legalism and elitism. Thoughts to consider in light of this “blue book” teachings:

Is there a demand for purity that divides the world into two classes of people?

“The world becomes sharply divided into the pure and the impure, the absolutely good (the group/ideology) and the absolutely evil (everything outside the group) one must continually change or conform to the group “norm”; tendencies towards guilt and shame are used as emotional levers for the group’s controlling and manipulative influences.”

Is there a sacred method/science for living?

“The totalist milieu maintains an aura of sacredness around its basic doctrine or ideology, holding it as an ultimate moral vision for the ordering of human existence. Questioning or criticizing those basic assumptions is prohibited. A reverence is demanded for the ideology/doctrine and the originators of the ideology/doctrine. The present bearers of the ideology/doctrine offer considerable security to young people because it greatly simplifies the world and answers a contemporary need to combine a sacred set of dogmatic principles with a claim to a science embodying the truth about human behavior and human psychology.”

(source)

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